Hitler's attributes

Discussion in 'World War 2' started by primalclaws1974, Nov 26, 2014.

  1. Hitler is likely the most hated and reviled person in all the history of the world, with maybe the exception of Judas Iscariot. Obviously most people do not adopt his canon, and abhor what he did and what he stood for. But he also had some qualities that I cannot deny. He was a terrific speaker. He roused people on a grand scale. Although greatly influenced through his speeches and propaganda, he was a very convincing leader. Although heinous, he was dedicated to his cause right to the end. Personally he also had quality values. He rarely drank or lost self-control. He did not smoke and he was dedicated to his mate.
  2. Interrogator#6

    Interrogator#6 Active Member

    Primal, I, too, am of mixed opinion regarding Adolf H. Yes, he was a dynamic orator. Yes, he could inspire mass devotion. And, yes he had some admirable personal qualities.

    But he also was at the core of madness and mass horror. In his name many people felt inspired to commit inhumanities to persons deemed to be untermensch, inferiors. He took ideas and ideals and made it fashionable to warp them into perversions in the name of a greater good.

    It is a subject upon which one can spend a lifetime of study and learning. Much ink has been spilled both during and after his lifetime. He was dynamic. He changed. He was not the same person in 1925 as he was in 1933, or 1939 or 1945. It might be interesting to chart the declineof his psychic, his mind, his personality or his soul if only one could establish the metrics upon which to gauge this illusive quality of personality -- but decline he did. He was not the same stable person in 1944 as he was in 1935.

    While it may be true that he neither smoke nor drank throughout his life he was a user of narcotics. In the end he was a heavy user. In his defence he may not have been aware of his own habits. He was under daily care of a personal physician who gave him injections of 'vitamins'. in reality these doses were increasing amounts of 'uppers' and 'downers' (depending on his sleep cycle). This caused him to grow increasingly irrational, increasingly divorsed from reality. And he would lose self control in his famous rants and monologue raves.

    My old college professor was on OSS colonel specializing in Nazi political dynamics. After the war he was a top interrogator at Ashcan (the name of the prison at Nuremberg were top Nazi leaders were held -- Brits named it Dustbin). While he never met Adolf himself he had long talks with several of his innermost circle: Kittle, Jodl, Guderaian. It was fasinating to listen to his impressions of Adolf's intimates.
  3. GearZ

    GearZ Member

    To call AH a complicated figure would be the understatement of the century. On one hand he was a gifted orator, political genius, and, at times, a shrewd tactician. On the other hand, he was a genocidal maniac, buffoon of a military strategist, and unbelievably inept at diplomacy. John Toland, in his classic biography Adolf Hitler, Volume I, perhaps said it best:

    "Adolf Hitler was probably the greatest mover and shaker of the twentieth century. Certainly no other human disrupted so many lives in our times or stirred such hatred. He also inspired widespread adoration and was the hope and ideal of millions. The passage of more than thirty years since his end has done little to alter the perspective of either enemies or true believers. Today we see the other leaders of his era—Roosevelt, Churchill, Mussolini, Stalin—in a different, more objective light but the image of Hitler remained essentially the same. To the few who remained his faithful followers he is a hero, a fallen Messiah; to the rest he is still a madman, a political and military bungler, an evil murderer beyond redemption whose successes were reached by criminal means."
    All said, he was a monster of unimaginable evil. Complex, yes, and has been and will likely always be the subject of genuine inquiry. But always a monster.
  4. wulfman

    wulfman Member

    Does anybody watch 'It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia" ? The shots they take at Hitler are hilarious. Although to be fair anyone that takes a shot at Hitler or Stalin will get some kind of chuckle. :)
  5. It was amazing how well people followed him. He convinced people that (at least outwardly) had been completely normal to become torturers and murderers. The doctors that torture-tested people had an oath to save people, but Hitler was able to convince them his will was more important. Security and police risked their lives in his name, and all of his new laws were accepted blindly. Even the average citizen would turn on their neighbors for him.
  6. Interrogator#6

    Interrogator#6 Active Member

    Prime, you err in many points. It demonstrates a lack of undertanding, a lack to truely understand the material which may be dangerous for those who are ignorant are in danger of being, like the Germans, manipulated and socially engineered into doing things against human interest. May I be permitted to enlighten you.

    Hitler was an Austrian citizen who identified himself as a German national rather than a member of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. For that reason he traveled to Germany. When the Great War began in 1914 he opted to join the German Army rather than the Austrian Army, even though the nations were allied. (This might be likened to an American joining the Canadian Army in WWII).

    Skipping ahead, after the war Adolf was still identifying himself as a German, as a patriot, as a super-nationalist. While acting as a minor agent for German military/political Intelligence he was >ordered< to investigate the DAP (German Worker's Party (Deutsche Arbieter Partie)). He found as a super-nationalist and patriot he really identified with the DAP, joined, and discovered his oratory talents. As these developed he soon rose to a leadership position, and had the name of the organization changed to the NSDAP (National Socsialistic Deutsch A.P.).

    Early, the policies and ideals of the party were nothing extreme -- national, patriotic, Christian, family-oriented, anti-pornographic, jobs for workers.... There was a little anti-Jewish rhetoric but because it was thought most of the pronography was economically sponcered by Jews, the same group who were being blamed for Germany's defeat in the Great War.

    Many of the themes used by early NSDAP rhetoric sound eerily similar to those espoused by the current American Republican Party, very "main-stream".

    Gradually the NSDAP message became more radical. Nothing was said about killing anyone, rather the message was protecting the family and purifying Society. Racial Hygene was promoted, the removal of bad elements from the gene-pool so as to protect all the good Germans. That is how the laws were passed which required people to research their ethnic heritage, so persons with inferior bloodlines should not polluted the Germanic Volk.

    It was all logical, sane, and safe -- at least to begin.
  7. Interrogator, there's no need to be so condescending. I know it goes against moral ethics of people to think of Hitler as anything but a racist, brutal killer and a madman. But that is too simplistic, and too easy to generalize. People do not want to think that a human, any human could commit such atrocities and not be a monster and/or insane. The fact was that he knew what he was doing, found value in it, and believed he was doing the right thing. In American courts he would have been fit to stand trial.
  8. Interrogator#6

    Interrogator#6 Active Member

    If I appear to be condescending permit me to extend my appology for it is not my aim to so do. It is just that most Americans are so badly educated about history and allied fields of knowledge: civics and politics. While most of the visiters to this blog show the good sense to wish to know of History, I fear a plurality still think of many historical personages in the two-dimentional iconic forms most have been reduced to.

    Your remark regarding Adolf as being unfit to stand trial shows both insight and at the same time a certain lack of vision, something common with most Americans. What my wish is is to assist you in transitioning from thinking of these historical persons not as cardboard icons but as the dynamic, living humans they once were.

    Yes, Adolf in April, 1945, was a spector, a wright, a shadow-being not fit to stand trial. But that was not because he was Evil embodied but because he was SICK. He was a Junkie and he had an advanced case of an STD. Most Americans do not know this. Rather they persist in thinking of Adolf only in the cartoonish characature which was developed in WWII propagda. Mention "Hitler" and everyone immediatly knows you are speaking about 'the Nazi TROLL', not the man who was twice TIME Magazine's 'Man of the Year'.

    Would Adolf been tried at Nuremberg? No, not in the condition he was in when last seen on film. But I feel every effort would have been made to cure him so he could stand the trial. This is what happened to Hermann Goering.

    Look at pictures of Herman before or immediately after capture. He was stout -- decidely so. This was due to his drug habit, and he he was not fit to stand trial. But look at pictures taken at to opening of his trial and one can see an astounding metamorphasis. In the time between capture and trial he lost a dramatic amount of weight, in excess of 50 pounds. This is because he was forced off his heroin habit.

    Perhaps this could have been done for Adolf as it as done for Hermann.
  9. GearZ

    GearZ Member

    • The 1920 Nazi Party platform, second section, fourth point "Only Nationals can be Citizens of the State. Only persons of German blood can be Nationals, regardless of religious affiliation. No Jew can therefore be a German National."(1)
    • Mein Kampf, published in 1926, is loaded with anti-Semitic material.(2)
    • Der Stürmer, an official Nazi Party tabloid-style paper, was first published in 1923 had contained some of the most vile caricatures of Jews in human history. (3)(4)
    • The Völkischer Beobachter, first published in 1923, while not as over the top as the aforementioned, was filled with anti-Semitic rhetoric.(5)
    • The 1932 Nazi Party platform, point number 5 of 12 is, quote, "German blood as a requirement for German citizenship. No Jew can be a member of the nation." (6)
    • Der Giftpilz, a children's book, published in 1938, was an believably depraved anti-Jewish book published by one Julius Streicher.

    1. The Nazi Party Platform, 1920.
    2. Adolf Hitler: Excerpts from Mein Kampf
    3. Caricatures from Der Stürmer: 1927-1932
    4. Caricatures from Der Stürmer
    5. Encyclopedia Britannic: Völkischer Beobachter
    6. The Nazi Party Platform, 1932
    7. Der Giftpilz
  10. Hitler's doctors were injecting him with what they called "vitamins". Maybe it was steroids. Maybe it really was vitamins. There is physical proof in videos that he was shaky, but that doesn't necessarily mean he was a junkie. Some have postulated that he had Parkinson's, or something similar. I have never heard that he had an STD. I have always read he was faithful.
  11. Interrogator#6

    Interrogator#6 Active Member

    Try googling "Hitler Medical Records". There are many pages which confirm Adolf recieved many diverse 'drugs', including cocaine. Dr. Morell, his personal physician, was captured and interviewed after the war and his files on Adolf were transfered to Allied hands.

    In all fairness I must correct myself regarding STDs. The most recent report I've read, from the "Irish Mail", refers to Adolf having "deformed genitalia". Other earlier readings refer to "treatment for gonoria (sp)". I am now confused and frankly disinterested in following this further.
  12. GearZ

    GearZ Member

    Its been long theorized that Hitler suffered from Syphilis, contracted before the Great War, and then reinfected during. Its never been proven, however, and his physical ailments could be attributed to other diseases. The NCBI has an interesting, short, read on the topic here.

    Regarding the medications, indeed, that is pretty well documented that he was a bunch of them.
  13. I don't subscribe to a lot of the theories that say people in history that made questionable choices made them because an illness made them "crazy". A decade ago there was a running idea that Edgar Allen Poe died of rabies. As for "deformed genitalia" on Hitler: he only had one testicle, or so I read. Sometimes odd facts like this are interesting, but in the end, it really does NOT have a lot to do with his actions and who he was.

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